A client had a (business) customer switch over to UFB and needed assistance reconfiguring the (Mikrotik) router being attached to the ONT -- it turned out whoever first set up the Mikrotik (sensibly) assumed it'd be seeing IP packets over VLAN 10, but actually the ISP required IP packets over PPPoE over VLAN 10 in order for it to work. Looking around it appears this client's customer's ISP isn't the only one that is requiring PPPoE over VLAN tagging over Ethernet for their UFB connections. Is there a reason other than "let's make everything look like 1990s dialup so it works with our legacy equipment" for the bit/CPE CPU overhead of PPPoE on UFB, including imposing the lowered usable MTU and PMTU discovery headaches on the end user? The only one that really comes to mind is "user/password authentication" (rather than needing to collect CPE MAC addresses which seems to happen with, eg, Vodafone cable/FibreX). But it's not clear to me why, eg, 802.1X isn't used for the user/password authentication in that case; or DHCP with some extension to pass a "secret" identifier. 20-bytes-per-packet-forever seems a large overhead to pay for user/password authentication at CPE power on.... (Maybe in the beginning there's "lack of CPE support" -- but we're a few years into the UFB rollout, and lots of ISPs seem to be supplying their own ISP-badged CPEs anyway, which could presumably implement whatever was needed.) Ewen