Geeks Put the Unsavvy on Alert: Learn or Log Off
Follow up to discussions at BGP04 http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/05/technology/05VIRU.html?ex=1077173129&ei=1&en=a25513797d965d8b
EXCELLENT !!!! I will frame it! :-) Michael Hallager Networkstuff Ltd
Follow up to discussions at BGP04
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/05/technology/05VIRU.html?ex=1077173129&ei=1 &en=a25513797d965d8b _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
-- // Michael Hallager Director || Head geek || Making IT work. URL: http://www.networkstuff.co.nz networkStuff, NZ's leading supplier of high quality used networking equipment. Phone: 09 837-6100 (DDI) 0800 638-788 (Freecall) Fax: 09 837-8100 0800 329-788 (Freecall) Mobile: 029 638 7883 Amateur radio: ZL1VMH (Auckland 6625 or 670)
On Sun, Feb 08, 2004 at 15:38 +1300, Andy Linton wrote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/05/technology/05VIRU.html?ex=1077173129&ei=1&en=a25513797d965d8b
I think if computers are the problem, and they are, because all these problems would go away with computers if they left (as would a lot of benefits), then they have to be the solution too. We can't teach everyone one on earth to be a "computer sophisticate," however quickly Microsoft is reducing that bar, they won't have space left for all the other non-computer things they have to know as well as some know IT. It is computers that have to become more sophisticated servants rather than humanity becoming a race of IT staff. Plus, it stands to reason that computers are going to get better faster than humans, look how far we've got... just past digital watches. Hamish. -- Never cut what you can untie. -- Joubert
Anyone on the list be able to confirm this? "download of 256k upload of 128k 1gig plan, 3 gig and a 10 gig plan! But instead of being charged for extra usage they throttle you to dialup speeds after the 10gig" http://www.angst.co.nz/arr.jpg Tristram Cheer Mobile: - 021-334-766 Work: - 04-499-9486 Fax: - 04-499-9586 After Hours: - 04-237-7593 ############################################################################ ######### This correspondence is for the named person's use only. It may contain confidential or legally privileged information, or both. No confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any mistransmission. If you receive this correspondence in error, please immediately delete it from your system and notify the sender. You must not disclose copy or rely on any part of this correspondence if you are not the intended recipient. -----Original Message----- From: Hamish MacEwan [mailto:NZNOG(a)Hamish.MacEwan.gen.nz] Sent: Sunday, 8 February 2004 9:37 p.m. To: nznog Subject: Re: [nznog] Geeks Put the Unsavvy on Alert: Learn or Log Off On Sun, Feb 08, 2004 at 15:38 +1300, Andy Linton wrote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/05/technology/05VIRU.html?ex=1077173129&ei=1& en=a25513797d965d8b I think if computers are the problem, and they are, because all these problems would go away with computers if they left (as would a lot of benefits), then they have to be the solution too. We can't teach everyone one on earth to be a "computer sophisticate," however quickly Microsoft is reducing that bar, they won't have space left for all the other non-computer things they have to know as well as some know IT. It is computers that have to become more sophisticated servants rather than humanity becoming a race of IT staff. Plus, it stands to reason that computers are going to get better faster than humans, look how far we've got... just past digital watches. Hamish. -- Never cut what you can untie. -- Joubert _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
Tristram Cheer wrote:
Anyone on the list be able to confirm this?
"download of 256k upload of 128k 1gig plan, 3 gig and a 10 gig plan! But instead of being charged for extra usage they throttle you to dialup speeds after the 10gig"
Not leaked -- annnounced today. Note that the pricing will be $10 less for customers who put all their calls through Telecom. $39.95/$49.95 for the 1GB plan with 5c/MB excess $49.95/$59.95 for the 3GB plan with 5c/MB excess $59.95/$69.95 for the 10GB plan with no excess charging, but throttling That's retail, with/without Telecom Calling. Resale is $10 less. -- Juha
Juha Saarinen wrote:
Not leaked -- annnounced today.
Note that the pricing will be $10 less for customers who put all their calls through Telecom.
$39.95/$49.95 for the 1GB plan with 5c/MB excess $49.95/$59.95 for the 3GB plan with 5c/MB excess $59.95/$69.95 for the 10GB plan with no excess charging, but throttling
That's retail, with/without Telecom Calling. Resale is $10 less.
Surely this must be seen as anti-competitive behaviour by the commerce commision. Who in their right mind is going to use another tolls provider, to save themselves $5 a month on calls, when being Telecom dangle this carrot infront of them.
Another interesting point... there is *again* no national/international differentiation. We have this with 128/128 jetstart plans, one would think telecom will have put some consideration into this with their new plans.. Sure, 10 gig is a bit. But 10 gig national? What's that costing telecom? I guess it is a step in the right direction, but we are still stuck banging our heads on brick walls stuck in the Stone Age to some extent. Juha Saarinen wrote:
Not leaked -- annnounced today.
Note that the pricing will be $10 less for customers who put all their calls through Telecom.
$39.95/$49.95 for the 1GB plan with 5c/MB excess $49.95/$59.95 for the 3GB plan with 5c/MB excess $59.95/$69.95 for the 10GB plan with no excess charging, but throttling
That's retail, with/without Telecom Calling. Resale is $10 less.
Surely this must be seen as anti-competitive behaviour by the commerce commision. Who in their right mind is going to use another tolls provider, to save themselves $5 a month on calls, when being Telecom dangle this carrot infront of them.
On Mon, 2004-02-09 at 14:36, Bryan Manson wrote:
Sure, 10 gig is a bit. But 10 gig national? What's that costing telecom? I guess it is a step in the right direction, but we are still stuck banging our heads on brick walls stuck in the Stone Age to some extent.
I have used the analogy for Jetstream of Telecom providing a ferrari that you can drive as fast as you want to go - in your own driveway at home. All they have done is slightly extended the driveway....and put a 50kms/hour speed cap on your Ferrari if you leave it.
Who in their right mind is going to use another tolls provider, to save themselves $5 a month on calls, when being Telecom dangle this carrot infront of them.
Quite easierly. I save HEAPS more then $10 per month by having my tollcalls with TelstraClear. :-) // Michael Hallager Director || Head geek || Making IT work. URL: http://www.networkstuff.co.nz networkStuff, NZ's leading supplier of high quality used networking equipment. Phone: 09 837-6100 (DDI) 0800 638-788 (Freecall) Fax: 09 837-8100 0800 329-788 (Freecall) Mobile: 029 638 7883 Amateur radio: ZL1VMH (Auckland 6625 or 670)
Leaked no. Service Information released to ISP's who offer the service yes. Thanks Craig
-----Original Message----- From: Tristram Cheer [mailto:james.edward(a)paradise.net.nz] Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 11:50 AM To: nznog(a)list.waikato.ac.nz Subject: [nznog] New Telecom Jetstream Plans Leaked?
Anyone on the list be able to confirm this?
"download of 256k upload of 128k 1gig plan, 3 gig and a 10 gig plan! But instead of being charged for extra usage they throttle you to dialup speeds after the 10gig"
http://www.angst.co.nz/arr.jpg
Tristram Cheer Mobile: - 021-334-766 Work: - 04-499-9486 Fax: - 04-499-9586 After Hours: - 04-237-7593
########################################################################## ## #########
This correspondence is for the named person's use only. It may contain confidential or legally privileged information, or both. No confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any mistransmission. If you receive this correspondence in error, please immediately delete it from your system and notify the sender. You must not disclose copy or rely on any part of this correspondence if you are not the intended recipient.
-----Original Message----- From: Hamish MacEwan [mailto:NZNOG(a)Hamish.MacEwan.gen.nz] Sent: Sunday, 8 February 2004 9:37 p.m. To: nznog Subject: Re: [nznog] Geeks Put the Unsavvy on Alert: Learn or Log Off
On Sun, Feb 08, 2004 at 15:38 +1300, Andy Linton wrote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/05/technology/05VIRU.html?ex=1077173129&ei= 1& en=a25513797d965d8b
I think if computers are the problem, and they are, because all these problems would go away with computers if they left (as would a lot of benefits), then they have to be the solution too.
We can't teach everyone one on earth to be a "computer sophisticate," however quickly Microsoft is reducing that bar, they won't have space left for all the other non-computer things they have to know as well as some know IT.
It is computers that have to become more sophisticated servants rather than humanity becoming a race of IT staff.
Plus, it stands to reason that computers are going to get better faster than humans, look how far we've got... just past digital watches.
Hamish.
-- Never cut what you can untie. -- Joubert _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
Hamish MacEwan wrote:
On Sun, Feb 08, 2004 at 15:38 +1300, Andy Linton wrote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/05/technology/05VIRU.html?ex=1077173129&ei=1&en=a25513797d965d8b
I think if computers are the problem, and they are, because all these problems would go away with computers if they left (as would a lot of benefits), then they have to be the solution too.
We can't teach everyone one on earth to be a "computer sophisticate," however quickly Microsoft is reducing that bar, they won't have space left for all the other non-computer things they have to know as well as some know IT.
I'm not sure I agree - that sounds a bit like the argument "It's a fair cop, guv, but society's to blame". I think people have take responsibilities for their actions and I'm coming more and more to the conclusion that if these lusers can't act responsibly on the net then either they should piss off or what's probably more likely the geeks should piss off and play in their own sandpit elsewhere. I speak as someone who with 'missionary like' zeal promoted the Internet for All view for a long time. As I get older and more reactionary I am more inclined to the view that most people are not equipped to be connected to the net with a powerful general purpose computer that they have no clue about. That doesn't mean that they can't be connected but that they need connected in a different way. Geoff Huston's talk at BGP04 proposed a model (Geoff, have you a link to the presentation? and the last half of the talk is available at http://www.r2.co.nz/20040129/) where the vast majority of users were effectively limited at their ISP to the half dozen or so things they need/want to do: email (but not able to connect globally to port 25) browse the net (via a proxy) games ..... Now before you all go off half cock about "I need 'ssh/irc/telnet/ftp/whois/weird protocol X' access think about what *most punters* need/want. I've watch this list turn into a discussion for large chunks of the time on how to fight virus fires which aren't helped by the combination of irresponsible users and systems manufacturers pouring petrol on the problem. At times I feel like saying could we have an NZ Virus Operations Group that deals with this somewhere else. (Along with the NZ Barrack Room Lawyers Group!) So unless you want to spend the rest of your life constantly fighting epidemics of virus infection then perhaps it's time to start thinking about how we can increase the level of Internet Public Health. There's pretty clear evidence that large chunks of the improvement in physical health in the last century were the results of improvements in santitation and hygiene and not just as the result of wonder drugs. McAfee, Norton etc are like drug companies - they have a job to do but perhaps its time to really start leaning on people to do the Internet equivalent of 'wash their hands, use disinfectants and use condoms (or even safer, restraint!)'
It is computers that have to become more sophisticated servants rather than humanity becoming a race of IT staff.
sophisticate: To cause to become less natural, especially to make less naive and more worldly So wouldn't have sensible default settings for firewalling and things like opening attachments etc be a start?
participants (9)
-
Andy Linton -
Bryan Manson -
Craig Whitmore -
Hamish MacEwan -
Jeremy Brooking -
Juha Saarinen -
Michael Hallager -
Steve Withers -
Tristram Cheer