How fair practice is this; is it spam? - Orcon Response
This has been posted on Behalf of Orcon MD by Craig Whitmore --- There appears to have been a serious mis-understanding between Barry and Orcon on this matter Orcon has NOT spammed Barry's customers, and Barry's post is very mis-leading. I will clarify Orcon's position, and lay out the facts, and then I suggest that Barry and Orcon take this matter offline as it is not something that needs to be discussed in NZNOG. Orcon has not, and never will: a) Spam potential customers seeking to provide them services b) Poach customers deliberately from wholesale customers, as a significant portion of our revenue comes from wholesale. What has happened is that our marketing department has been in MUTUAL contact with the owner of a single website, and came to an arrangement whereby we would receive free advertising on the person's website in return for providing free web-hosting and domain name registration. Our marketing department was not aware that this website owner was actually a customer of a customer of Barry's. The website owner has contacted their provider (a customer of a Barry's), and told them that they were moving to us, and the provider and Barry have come to the knee-jerk reaction that we are trying to poach customers. This is absolutely NOT the case. Once Barry made us aware of the issue, Barry's account manager tried to point out that end users are free to choose whichever web hosting provider they want, and that sometimes we lose customers to our wholesale hosting customers and vice-versa - this does NOT mean we are poaching customers or spamming people. However, our account manager communicated this to Barry in a less than elegant manner, and via email, after I had specifically asked that Barry be called so that the situation could be discussed and explained rationally. It is NOT our desire that Barry be upset, This is a SINGLE website owner who had prior discussions with our marketing department, and this conflict has only just been brought to our attention. Thanks for reading NZNOGer's - thanks for your time. Regards Seeby Woodhouse MD Orcon Internet -----Original Message----- From: Barry Murphy [mailto:barry(a)unix.co.nz] Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 2:23 PM To: nznog(a)list.waikato.ac.nz Subject: [nznog] How fair practice is this; is it spam? ok.... how fair is this... I purchase telehousing from orcon and register domains through them. They have spammed one of my customers offering to host their website free of charge in return for advertising space on their website. After hearing this I emailed my account manager at orcon and this was his response. "As Im sure you are aware, Orcon also runs hosting, and as such, from a marketing perspective we have to treat other web hosting companies as competition, even if they are buying wholesale services from us. All other ISP's do the same - Telecom actively market to our customers for all ISP services even though we purchase a massive amount of wholesale services off them. " Is this spam/fair practice? Seeing as they could obtain a list of these domains in their database (as they're the registrar for this domain) Kindest Regards Barry Murphy _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
To close this threat off, I apologize for bring this to nznog, I was just
expressing the feelings of a customer of mine.
I have spoken to Seeby and this was all a mis-understanding and he has
advised it wont happen again.
Over and out.
Thanks
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Whitmore"
This has been posted on Behalf of Orcon MD by Craig Whitmore
---
There appears to have been a serious mis-understanding between Barry and Orcon on this matter
Orcon has NOT spammed Barry's customers, and Barry's post is very mis-leading.
I will clarify Orcon's position, and lay out the facts, and then I suggest that Barry and Orcon take this matter offline as it is not something that needs to be discussed in NZNOG.
Orcon has not, and never will:
a) Spam potential customers seeking to provide them services b) Poach customers deliberately from wholesale customers, as a significant portion of our revenue comes from wholesale.
What has happened is that our marketing department has been in MUTUAL contact with the owner of a single website, and came to an arrangement whereby we would receive free advertising on the person's website in return for providing free web-hosting and domain name registration.
Our marketing department was not aware that this website owner was actually a customer of a customer of Barry's.
The website owner has contacted their provider (a customer of a Barry's), and told them that they were moving to us, and the provider and Barry have come to the knee-jerk reaction that we are trying to poach customers. This is absolutely NOT the case.
Once Barry made us aware of the issue, Barry's account manager tried to point out that end users are free to choose whichever web hosting provider they want, and that sometimes we lose customers to our wholesale hosting customers and vice-versa - this does NOT mean we are poaching customers or spamming people.
However, our account manager communicated this to Barry in a less than elegant manner, and via email, after I had specifically asked that Barry be called so that the situation could be discussed and explained rationally.
It is NOT our desire that Barry be upset, This is a SINGLE website owner who had prior discussions with our marketing department, and this conflict has only just been brought to our attention.
Thanks for reading NZNOGer's - thanks for your time.
Regards Seeby Woodhouse
MD Orcon Internet
-----Original Message----- From: Barry Murphy [mailto:barry(a)unix.co.nz] Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 2:23 PM To: nznog(a)list.waikato.ac.nz Subject: [nznog] How fair practice is this; is it spam?
ok.... how fair is this... I purchase telehousing from orcon and register domains through them. They have spammed one of my customers offering to host their website free of charge in return for advertising space on their website.
After hearing this I emailed my account manager at orcon and this was his response.
"As Im sure you are aware, Orcon also runs hosting, and as such, from a marketing perspective we have to treat other web hosting companies as competition, even if they are buying wholesale services from us. All other ISP's do the same - Telecom actively market to our customers for all ISP services even though we purchase a massive amount of wholesale services off them. "
Is this spam/fair practice? Seeing as they could obtain a list of these domains in their database (as they're the registrar for this domain)
Kindest Regards Barry Murphy
_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog
participants (2)
-
Barry Murphy -
Craig Whitmore