On 2/09/2011, at 10:28 AM, Neil Gardner wrote:

On 2 September 2011 10:23, Jay Daley wrote:

...

I think that is entirely unfair. The objections that bring the strongest complaints are:

- this is disproportionate - in the punishments available, the cost of the process, and the priority given to the list - it turns due process on its head - far too many innocent people will be affected because of the crap techniques used to identify infringement and the difficulty in challenging it

Jay

Please! We have credible media commentators and prominent figures within the NZ community going on record saying they will continue to illegally download stuff because the media companies won't change their distribution models...

Where exactly have they said that? What I've heard them say is that a key reason people download illegally in NZ is because of the poor availability of legal content, particularly when compared to other markets. And so long as that continues, that will stay as a reason to download illegally. That's a statement of fact, not a statement of intent.

Disproportionate? The fine is _UP TO_ $15k, and COULD (but I agree won't be) be as low at a few hundred $ (including costs)

$15k is grossly disproportionate. The RHs have consistently overstated the true cost of piracy and yet their figures still carry weight in this process. Even the US Gov't called their figures rubbish: http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d10423.pdf

Due process on head? As was shown a few pages back, there's an assumption initially that the information presented by the rights holders is correct (and the methods for this will have been reviewed by an industry group within NZ), but if challenged in the tribunal, the onus is on the rights holder to show their information is correct.

Due process would be RHs going to tribunal and having to provide evidence to establish their case and that evidence being open to challenge. In this topsy turvy process they don't have to provide evidence, only an allegation, and that is presumed to be correct and then the accused has to challenge it.

As I have said, I think the law does suck - but the arguments most people are using against it are a steaming pile of BS.

So your reasons for thinking the law sucks are better than most people's? cheers Jay

Cheers -N

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