An impetus for advancement in New Zealand's enum use is all well and good, but I think everyone except a couple of people holding some fringe beliefs would prefer it if it was managed and controlled by an organisation that serves the public interest. The rejection of Jame's application wasn't just inevitable, it was entirely proper. Apart from the viewpoint that it's an attempt to become king of enum, you'd think someone with an understanding of the industry would come with peer recommendations; would have familiarised the operator community with their proposal and gained their support; would have introduced themselves to and liaised with the people who are to approve his application and have more than just a loose plan to dominate enum in place. So in effect it's an industry foreigner who doesn't speak the language trying to crown himself king of enum. Let the government run it. Then at least we can get beer money when they sell it. On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:48 PM, Don Gould wrote:

Top marks to James for pushing this issue along!

Those who are interested in the numbering debate can find a great deal of information on the ComCom site here:

http://www.comcom.govt.nz/IndustryRegulation/Telecommunications/Inquiries,Re...

Perhaps James hasn't followed 'protocol' but given how far NZ is behind major parts of the world in IP at present, perhaps it's long past time we got off our soap boxes and actually did some technical work to push things along!

Cheers Don

Don Gould wrote:

Justin Cook wrote:

...

place. So in effect it's an industry foreigner who doesn't speak the language trying to crown himself king of enum.

Justin I find your comments about James rude and uncalled for.

I have talked to James personally on the telephone about this issue and feel he's very open to ideas and his principle motivation seems, to me, to be to get a fire under this issue and push it along.

Well said Don. The enum issue does need a rocket and thats exactly what James has provided. Lets try and keep the discussions on to a professional level. Dean

Justin, I think you raised some very valid points. I also think some other people did as well (Steve for example). However I don't think your points are operational and are more political and business nature, hence not valid for this list. Can you, or anyone suggest a public forum that this sort of debate is valid on? If not, then I suggest we set up a list for some robust debate on the issue. Cheers Don Justin Cook wrote:

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 2:48 PM, Don Gould mailto:don(a)bowenvale.co.nz> wrote:

So in effect it's an industry foreigner who doesn't speak the language trying to crown himself king of enum.

Justin I find your comments about James rude and uncalled for.

I have talked to James personally on the telephone about this issue and feel he's very open to ideas and his principle motivation seems, to me, to be to get a fire under this issue and push it along.

How dare I question someone's industry credentials after they submit an application to privately dominate a public asset that consisted of one short sentence? His efforts were sub-par and tell you everything you need to know about his viability to be a registrar. I suggest you take Dean's advice and keep it professional rather than vicariously reading insult in metaphor.

I think what you meant to say was "GET the government to run it."

As such, I have called the MED today [1] to identify who is working on this project within MED and express my support for some urgency in pushing the issue along.

The NAD reports, that ComCom wrote, made clear that this issue has been stalled long enough to let number portability be sorted out.

This is an evasive way of saying you think it's free money ripe for the taking. That has clearly failed as a justification in the MED's view. Does anyone here see why James above all other applicants should be the enum registrar? Perhaps more of his peers would consider him if he had worked on an industry presence during his rush to the enum throne.

Humm... so you're saying that if James was to set up a commercial enum registry that funded beer drinking for NZNog members, then you'd be happy with that outcome?

You must be new around here.

You have asserted with a combination of mistruth and spin that we should be giving someone control over something for free, over and above others who have expressed interest in managing that namespace properly. Where are his credentials? Why should James Jones become the enum registrar - apparently in your opinion without challenge. Is there a particular reason you want to shout down dissent?

I hold the opinion if the government isn't going to run E.164, the management of such a service should fall to the largest and most public providers, not the smallest and most private. Why shouldn't a group to manage enum be formed from interested participants from existing NOGs? To me enum is a solution, not a problem waiting to be solved itself. Water runs downhill. Telcos implement services as they need them. The sun sets. enum.org.nz http://enum.org.nz already belongs to an authority who manages namespaces. Et cetera.

I suspect most people on this list can't be bothered commenting because they know the outcome and its inevitability. Enum doesn't need James Jones or his cheer team to be viable. His attempt at rounding up community support has mostly failed. But that's my two NZNOG posts over for another year.

On Jan 15, 2009, at 1:36 PM, Don Gould wrote:

If not, then I suggest we set up a list for some robust debate on the issue.

And please don't forget the NZNOG conference as a forum for robust debate and face discussions. The lightning talks are now open. Given the ferocity of this thread I would be disappointed if there were not at least one concerning ENUM. Cheers, Jonny.

It has been suggested to me that there will be some debate.

Brilliant, I think we can turn this into a spectator sport to raise money for beer. Can someone arrange for a snake/crocodile/sarlacc pit? I'll sort out big foam-padded sticks and coloured shirts for the teams. Even though the combatants, er, dabaters, will be fighting to the death, it's always funny seeing people being bashed in the head with big foam-padded objects. -- Spiro Harvey Knossos Networks Ltd 021-295-1923 www.knossos.net.nz

To bad I will not be in attendance. On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 11:39 AM, Spiro Harvey wrote:

...

It has been suggested to me that there will be some debate.

Brilliant, I think we can turn this into a spectator sport to raise money for beer.

Can someone arrange for a snake/crocodile/sarlacc pit? I'll sort out big foam-padded sticks and coloured shirts for the teams.

Even though the combatants, er, dabaters, will be fighting to the death, it's always funny seeing people being bashed in the head with big foam-padded objects.

-- Spiro Harvey Knossos Networks Ltd 021-295-1923 www.knossos.net.nz

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Agreed! Kind Regards, Craig Spiers - Network Manager Solarix Limited DDI: +64 9 974 4753 | FAX: +64 9 523 8057 FAULTS: 0800 89 41 42 MOB: +64 21 857 183 | email: craig.spiers(a)staff.solarix.co.nz The information contained in this email is privileged and confidential and intended for the addressee only. If you are not the intended recipient you are asked to respect that confidentiality and not disclose, copy or make use of its contents. If received in error you are asked to destroy this email and contact the sender immediately. -----Original Message----- From: Jean-Francois Pirus [mailto:jfp(a)clearfield.com] Sent: Friday, 16 January 2009 12:01 p.m. To: nznog Subject: [nznog] Enum - Make it stop Could we stop with the Enum thread. Please. This is an operationsl list not a forum/discussion list. While some allowances can be made, it has now been going on for 3 weeks... -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jean-Francois Pirus Technical Manager Phone (+64-9) 358 2081 Clearfield Software Ltd Fax (+64-9) 358 2083 1st Floor 8-10 Whitaker Place Mob (+64-21) 640 779 P O Box 3901 Auckland, New Zealand ------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog