Cloudflare on the APE

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Re: [nznog] Licence NZNOG video...

Jamie Baddeley

30 Nov 2014 30 Nov '14

6:45 a.m.

With N4L joining the APE the fun keeps coming.. New CDN in town and it's a win for NZ. http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-... At an operational level I'm sure the CloudFlare guys will provide an update soon. regards jamie

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Tim Hoffman

30 Nov 30 Nov

8:04 a.m.

Thanks Jamie, CloudFlare are imminently deploying a node in New Zealand, bringing a large amount of content closer to y’all! We’ll be at all 3 IXs in Auckland, plus will be accepting 1Gbit and 10Gbit single mode fibre PNIs (where traffic levels make a PNI seem sensible) at “The Datacenter” (220 Queen Street, Auckland). We do provide IPv4 & IPv6 routes to the route-servers at most IXs; however, we only provide a subset of our routes via this mechanism (the non-anycast ones - i.e. not the ones with the content on them!)). A direct peering session between our ASNs will provide all our routes (including the anycast routes) and hence ensure that you are not going offshore to get at our content. We do not require BGP MD5 passwords (however we will accept your MD5 password, if you use one). We request max-prefix sizes of 500 for IPv4 and 100 for IPv6. Our full peering information can be found in PeeringDB at http://as13335.peeringdb.com/ and is up to date. Our NOC contact info is as follows: CloudFlare NOC contact: noc(a)cloudflare.com CloudFlare NOC phone: +1 650 319 8930 CloudFlare Peering contact: peering(a)cloudflare.com mailto:peering(a)cloudflare.com I’m expecting us to be going live in the next couple of weeks - but for now feel free to email us at the peering address above and Marty and Luke will get back to you as soon as we’re ready to go live. Thanks in advance for peering! Cheers, Hoff

...

On Nov 30, 2014, at 5:45 PM, Jamie Baddeley wrote:

With N4L joining the APE the fun keeps coming..

New CDN in town and it's a win for NZ.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-... http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-...

At an operational level I'm sure the CloudFlare guys will provide an update soon.

regards

jamie _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

mcfbbqroast .

8:30 a.m.

Can I just say thanks for replying like this? Over the last few days I've seen lots of confusion about how various new content providers will enter the market, so props for the timely, informative post. On 1 Dec 2014 16:04, "Tim Hoffman" wrote:

...

Thanks Jamie,

CloudFlare are imminently deploying a node in New Zealand, bringing a large amount of content closer to y’all!

We’ll be at all 3 IXs in Auckland, plus will be accepting 1Gbit and 10Gbit single mode fibre PNIs (where traffic levels make a PNI seem sensible) at “The Datacenter” (220 Queen Street, Auckland).

We do provide IPv4 & IPv6 routes to the route-servers at most IXs; however, we only provide a subset of our routes via this mechanism (the non-anycast ones - i.e. not the ones with the content on them!)). A direct peering session between our ASNs will provide all our routes (including the anycast routes) and hence ensure that you are not going offshore to get at our content.

We do not require BGP MD5 passwords (however we will accept your MD5 password, if you use one). We request max-prefix sizes of 500 for IPv4 and 100 for IPv6. Our full peering information can be found in PeeringDB at http://as13335.peeringdb.com/ and is up to date. Our NOC contact info is as follows:

CloudFlare NOC contact: noc(a)cloudflare.com CloudFlare NOC phone: +1 650 319 8930 CloudFlare Peering contact: peering(a)cloudflare.com

I’m expecting us to be going live in the next couple of weeks - but for now feel free to email us at the peering address above and Marty and Luke will get back to you as soon as we’re ready to go live.

Thanks in advance for peering!

Cheers, Hoff

On Nov 30, 2014, at 5:45 PM, Jamie Baddeley wrote:

With N4L joining the APE the fun keeps coming..

New CDN in town and it's a win for NZ.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-...

At an operational level I'm sure the CloudFlare guys will provide an update soon.

regards

jamie _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

Tim Hoffman

10:06 a.m.

Happy to help, and thanks for the kind feedback :) This should provide huge benefit to NZ as we see more content localized. Cheers Tim Sent from my iPhone

...

On Nov 30, 2014, at 7:30 PM, mcfbbqroast . wrote:

Can I just say thanks for replying like this? Over the last few days I've seen lots of confusion about how various new content providers will enter the market, so props for the timely, informative post.

...
On 1 Dec 2014 16:04, "Tim Hoffman" wrote: Thanks Jamie,

CloudFlare are imminently deploying a node in New Zealand, bringing a large amount of content closer to y’all!

We’ll be at all 3 IXs in Auckland, plus will be accepting 1Gbit and 10Gbit single mode fibre PNIs (where traffic levels make a PNI seem sensible) at “The Datacenter” (220 Queen Street, Auckland).

We do provide IPv4 & IPv6 routes to the route-servers at most IXs; however, we only provide a subset of our routes via this mechanism (the non-anycast ones - i.e. not the ones with the content on them!)). A direct peering session between our ASNs will provide all our routes (including the anycast routes) and hence ensure that you are not going offshore to get at our content.

We do not require BGP MD5 passwords (however we will accept your MD5 password, if you use one). We request max-prefix sizes of 500 for IPv4 and 100 for IPv6. Our full peering information can be found in PeeringDB at http://as13335.peeringdb.com/ and is up to date. Our NOC contact info is as follows:

CloudFlare NOC contact: noc(a)cloudflare.com CloudFlare NOC phone: +1 650 319 8930 CloudFlare Peering contact: peering(a)cloudflare.com

I’m expecting us to be going live in the next couple of weeks - but for now feel free to email us at the peering address above and Marty and Luke will get back to you as soon as we’re ready to go live.

Thanks in advance for peering!

Cheers, Hoff

...
On Nov 30, 2014, at 5:45 PM, Jamie Baddeley wrote:

With N4L joining the APE the fun keeps coming..

New CDN in town and it's a win for NZ.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-...

At an operational level I'm sure the CloudFlare guys will provide an update soon.

regards

jamie _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

Dean Pemberton

2:06 p.m.

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 6:06 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...

This should provide huge benefit to NZ as we see more content localized.

jon.brewer

3:25 p.m.

...

On 1/12/2014, at 20:06, Dean Pemberton wrote:

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P

I hear some exchange operators show per-port participant stats. Was always too "commercially sensitive" for WIX/APE.

...

...
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 6:06 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote: This should provide huge benefit to NZ as we see more content localized.

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

Jamie Baddeley

3:40 p.m.

On 1 December 2014 at 23:25, jon.brewer wrote:

...

...
On 1/12/2014, at 20:06, Dean Pemberton wrote:

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P

I hear some exchange operators show per-port participant stats.

...

Was always too "commercially sensitive" for WIX/APE.

http://xkcd.com/285/

jamie

Jonathan Brewer

1 Dec 1 Dec

1:54 a.m.

On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 9:40 PM, Jamie Baddeley wrote:

...

On 1 December 2014 at 23:25, jon.brewer wrote:

...
...
On 1/12/2014, at 20:06, Dean Pemberton wrote:

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P

I hear some exchange operators show per-port participant stats.

...
Was always too "commercially sensitive" for WIX/APE.

http://xkcd.com/285/

Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given. https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

Cameron Daniel

3:33 a.m.

On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote:

...

Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given.

https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG [2]

Suggest NZIX get to it.

-JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough? Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback. Cheers Cameron Megaport

Tim Hoffman

3:38 a.m.

...

On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote:

...
Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given. https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG [2] Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea. It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also. Cheers, Tim

Dean Pemberton

3:58 a.m.

That sounds like a great thing. Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time. On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...

...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote:

...
Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given. https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG [2] Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

Cheers, Tim

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

Joe Wooller

4:01 a.m.

Hey All FWIW our peering graphs are made public. Regards Joe Sent from my iPhone

...

On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton wrote:

That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...
...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

...
On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given. https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG [2] Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

Cheers, Tim

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

!DSPAM:1,547cf29426164918713345!

Dean Pemberton

5:08 a.m.

They are indeed - Well done!!! Here are the links for those interested in seeing examples. http://www.ix.asn.au/peering.html http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph_view.php http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=368&rra_id=all http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=91&rra_id=all On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Joe Wooller wrote:

...

Hey All

FWIW our peering graphs are made public.

Regards Joe

Sent from my iPhone

...
On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton wrote:

That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...
...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

...
On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given. https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG [2] Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

Cheers, Tim

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

!DSPAM:1,547cf29426164918713345!

Michael Smith

5:15 a.m.

Seattle Internet Exchange (SIX) hat on We provide aggregate throughput data, but we have always heard from the majority of our members that per-port usage graphs should not be made available. Any provider that doesn't disclose usage data, and there are many, will balk at having their port stats publicly available. In some cases, this disclosure is serious enough to preclude them from participation if said disclosure is required. Mike On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 4:08 PM, Dean Pemberton wrote:

...

They are indeed - Well done!!!

Here are the links for those interested in seeing examples.

http://www.ix.asn.au/peering.html http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph_view.php

http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=368&rra_id=all http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=91&rra_id=all

...
Hey All

FWIW our peering graphs are made public.

Regards Joe

Sent from my iPhone

...
On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton wrote:

That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...
...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

...
On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given.

https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG

...
[2] Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Joe Wooller wrote: party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

...
...
...
Cheers, Tim

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

!DSPAM:1,547cf29426164918713345!

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

-- Michael K. Smith Senior Manager - APAC Network Strategy Netflix, Inc. Mobile: +1.206.719.2333 Skype: mksmith.netflix

Dean Pemberton

5:27 a.m.

It's all about knowing your customers and operating appropriately in different markets. New Zealand may very well be the same as Seattle, or it could be different. I'd be interested to hear from some of the people peering at the AKL exchanges about their views on port stats. Michael makes a good point, but we know other areas where New Zealand businesses are a lot more relaxed about this sort of stuff than non-New Zealand businesses. In the mean time have a big thumbs up for the aggregate stats! https://www.seattleix.net/agg.htm On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 1:15 PM, Michael Smith wrote:

...

Seattle Internet Exchange (SIX) hat on

We provide aggregate throughput data, but we have always heard from the majority of our members that per-port usage graphs should not be made available. Any provider that doesn't disclose usage data, and there are many, will balk at having their port stats publicly available. In some cases, this disclosure is serious enough to preclude them from participation if said disclosure is required.

Mike

On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 4:08 PM, Dean Pemberton wrote:

...
They are indeed - Well done!!!

Here are the links for those interested in seeing examples.

http://www.ix.asn.au/peering.html http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph_view.php

http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=368&rra_id=all http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=91&rra_id=all

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Joe Wooller wrote:

...
Hey All

FWIW our peering graphs are made public.

Regards Joe

Sent from my iPhone

...
On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton wrote:

That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...
...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

> On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: > Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on > WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation > questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was > given. > > https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG > [2] > Suggest NZIX get to it. > -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

Cheers, Tim

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

!DSPAM:1,547cf29426164918713345!

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

-- Michael K. Smith Senior Manager - APAC Network Strategy Netflix, Inc. Mobile: +1.206.719.2333 Skype: mksmith.netflix

Michael Smith

6:31 a.m.

Also remember that the hope is to have an international customer base on the exchanges. At the SIX our base is pretty diverse, and somewhat anecdotally we see: 1) Small players (no pejorative implied) - normally most don't care 2) Large players (no kudos implied) - don't want per-port stats 3) Carriers (insert "implieds") - don't want per-port stats Mike On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 4:27 PM, Dean Pemberton wrote:

...

It's all about knowing your customers and operating appropriately in different markets.

New Zealand may very well be the same as Seattle, or it could be different. I'd be interested to hear from some of the people peering at the AKL exchanges about their views on port stats. Michael makes a good point, but we know other areas where New Zealand businesses are a lot more relaxed about this sort of stuff than non-New Zealand businesses.

In the mean time have a big thumbs up for the aggregate stats! https://www.seattleix.net/agg.htm

...
Seattle Internet Exchange (SIX) hat on

We provide aggregate throughput data, but we have always heard from the majority of our members that per-port usage graphs should not be made available. Any provider that doesn't disclose usage data, and there are many, will balk at having their port stats publicly available. In some cases, this disclosure is serious enough to preclude them from

...
if said disclosure is required.

Mike

On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 4:08 PM, Dean Pemberton wrote:

...
They are indeed - Well done!!!

Here are the links for those interested in seeing examples.

http://www.ix.asn.au/peering.html http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph_view.php

http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=368&rra_id=all

...
http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=91&rra_id=all

...
On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Joe Wooller wrote:

...
Hey All

FWIW our peering graphs are made public.

Regards Joe

Sent from my iPhone

...
On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton wrote:

That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a

...
...
...
...
website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...
> On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel > wrote: > >> On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: >> Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on >> WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation >> questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was >> given. >> >> https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG >> [2] >> Suggest NZIX get to it. >> -JB > > What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big > deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be > enough? > > Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in > on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 1:15 PM, Michael Smith wrote: participation public the

...
...
...
...
...
party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

Cheers, Tim

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

!DSPAM:1,547cf29426164918713345!

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

-- Michael K. Smith Senior Manager - APAC Network Strategy Netflix, Inc. Mobile: +1.206.719.2333 Skype: mksmith.netflix

-- Michael K. Smith Senior Manager - APAC Network Strategy Netflix, Inc. Mobile: +1.206.719.2333 Skype: mksmith.netflix

paul tinson

5:28 a.m.

I wonder if a view like that from REANNZ would be seen as useful? The archive/replay of a day is quite handy for reviewing hot spots. http://weathermap.reannz.co.nz/ On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 1:08 PM, Dean Pemberton wrote:

...

They are indeed - Well done!!!

Here are the links for those interested in seeing examples.

http://www.ix.asn.au/peering.html http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph_view.php

http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=368&rra_id=all http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=91&rra_id=all

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Joe Wooller wrote:

...
Hey All

FWIW our peering graphs are made public.

Regards Joe

Sent from my iPhone

...
On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton wrote:

That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...
...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

...
On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was given. https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG [2] Suggest NZIX get to it. -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

Cheers, Tim

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Jamie Curtis

6:02 a.m.

Through the REANNZ weathermap you can continue to drill down into individual connections and get traffic graphs for the past 12 months. This includes our ports on the APE, WIX and CHIX. To save lots of clicking, here are direct links to those: http://weathermap.reannz.co.nz/node.php?src=and01&int=ge_1_0_0 http://weathermap.reannz.co.nz/node.php?src=and02&int=ge_1_0_7 http://weathermap.reannz.co.nz/node.php?src=and03&int=ge_1_0_2 Any other providers have public graphs of their peering ports that they can share? Jamie On 2 December 2014 at 13:28, paul tinson wrote:

...

I wonder if a view like that from REANNZ would be seen as useful? The archive/replay of a day is quite handy for reviewing hot spots.

http://weathermap.reannz.co.nz/

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 1:08 PM, Dean Pemberton wrote:

...
They are indeed - Well done!!!

Here are the links for those interested in seeing examples.

http://www.ix.asn.au/peering.html http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph_view.php

http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=368&rra_id=all

...
http://monitor.nsw.ix.asn.au/cacti/graph.php?local_graph_id=91&rra_id=all

...
On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Joe Wooller wrote:

...
Hey All

FWIW our peering graphs are made public.

Regards Joe

Sent from my iPhone

...
On 2 Dec 2014, at 6:58 am, Dean Pemberton

...
...
...
That sounds like a great thing.

Cameron - my on-list feedback - This gets my vote. Put it on a public website and it should be able to show a good amount of growth over time.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tim Hoffman

wrote:

...
...
...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 2:33 PM, Cameron Daniel wrote:

> On 2014-12-02 6:54 am, Jonathan Brewer wrote: > Lucky for the community, Richard recorded all the NZNOG talks on > WIX/APE over the years - including the ones where port utilisation > questions were asked and the "commercially sensitive" response was > given. > https://www.google.com.sb/webhp?ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=site:www.r2.co.nz+NZNOG > [2] > Suggest NZIX get to it. > -JB

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

A fine idea.

It would be good if we can see both Citylink and Megaport come to the

wrote: party in the near future with providing graphs of at least their aggregate IX load, and if possible specific graphs of non-objecting peers also.

...
...
...
...
Cheers, Tim

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NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

Tim Warnock

4:21 a.m.

...

What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

Cheers Cameron Megaport

Just make it that their graphs will always show up if the port is running hot :) - it's a great way to see who needs more bandwidth (which normally results in complaints).

Denver Maddux

4:55 a.m.

On Dec 2, 2014, at 9:21 AM, Tim Warnock wrote:

...

...
What about an opt-in or opt-out per port display? Totals aren't a big deal but for the more sensitive types, being able to opt-out might be enough?

Currently looking at what we do for this kind of thing, interested in on- or off-list feedback.

Cheers Cameron Megaport

Just make it that their graphs will always show up if the port is running hot :) - it's a great way to see who needs more bandwidth (which normally results in complaints).

Public shaming rarely works in one’s favor. :) We’re committed to exposing aggregate graphs on the IX portion of the platform in the near future. The numbers aren’t going to make anyone swoon, but transparency is the key, not volume. Denver Maddux CEO Megaport

Tim Warnock

8:43 a.m.

...

Public shaming rarely works in one’s favor. :)

We’re committed to exposing aggregate graphs on the IX portion of the platform in the near future. The numbers aren’t going to make anyone swoon, but transparency is the key, not volume.

Denver Maddux CEO Megaport

Hi Denver, It was never about public shaming, but at least the other participants of the exchange would be able to see what's going on. I'm not an advocate of having graphs truly publically accessible, but behind a portal you should be able to see the other participants port usage. Its immensely valuable for troubleshooting. Also - some IXs have a policy that if you run your port hot and refuse to upgrade they can terminate your service. I've not seen it done in practice however (after all - who would want to turn off a paying customer.) Tim

Denver Maddux

9:30 a.m.

On Dec 2, 2014, at 1:43 PM, Tim Warnock wrote:

...

...
Public shaming rarely works in one’s favor. :)

We’re committed to exposing aggregate graphs on the IX portion of the platform in the near future. The numbers aren’t going to make anyone swoon, but transparency is the key, not volume.

Denver Maddux CEO Megaport

Hi Denver,

It was never about public shaming, but at least the other participants of the exchange would be able to see what's going on.

I'm not an advocate of having graphs truly publically accessible, but behind a portal you should be able to see the other participants port usage. Its immensely valuable for troubleshooting.

Also - some IXs have a policy that if you run your port hot and refuse to upgrade they can terminate your service. I've not seen it done in practice however (after all - who would want to turn off a paying customer.)

Tim

Hey Tim, I was being light-hearted about public shaming. At earlier points of my career I was a big fan of the full disclosure of all ports from exchanges, but most of us understand the varying business sensitivities each of us have to honor wherever we work these days. Perception of implied performance due to visibility of port status across a fabric will always be an area for debate. There are certainly ways to alleviate some of the concerns by providing fabric level and metro area link status thereby eliminating some areas of concern and helping to faster pinpoint performance issues. I’m happy to keep opening the data for Megaport publicly, and as our membership grows, where most useful and keeping privacy concerns in mind. Cameron suggested a great option of opting in or out of showing volunteered data behind the portal login, which we’ll just get done. Denver

Simon Lyall

2 Dec 2 Dec

4:15 a.m.

On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, Denver Maddux wrote:

...

I was being light-hearted about public shaming. At earlier points of my career I was a big fan of the full disclosure of all ports from exchanges, but most of us understand the varying business sensitivities each of us have to honor wherever we work these days.

While per-port would be nice I think any stats would be great. One of the problems I've had in the past is that I couldn't point to a graph of APE and say "Look people are exchanging x Gb/s at peak over this, maybe it will be worth us joining". Personally I always had a sneaking suspicion that Citylink never released graphs because the actual amount of traffic was tiny. Probably not true but how could I tell? -- Simon Lyall | Very Busy | Web: http://www.simonlyall.com/ "To stay awake all night adds a day to your life" - Stilgar

Alexander Neilson

4:28 a.m.

I see sufficient traffic taken at peak time to satisfy myself that its saving money for my organisation (but I agree, hard to point at that without numbers - and before you have a port) I am very excited to see what comes from having Cloudflare directly peering on the exchange (and I have signed up to peer across the fabric when launched) I have also noticed that Akamai are also on APE (they may have been for a while but I didn’t see it on their PeeringDB entry when I last looked at this. Does anyone know if you need to direct peer across the fabric to them to get much utilisation or are they just announcing everything they will announce publicly? APE and WIX ports have also allowed me to help out other networks in distress before where both parties could get to the same exchange when normal connections externally have a failure and we have been able to help them along until the repair arrived. Regards Alexander Alexander Neilson Neilson Productions Limited alexander(a)neilson.net.nz 021 329 681 022 456 2326

...

On 3/12/2014, at 12:15 pm, Simon Lyall wrote:

On Tue, 2 Dec 2014, Denver Maddux wrote:

...
I was being light-hearted about public shaming. At earlier points of my career I was a big fan of the full disclosure of all ports from exchanges, but most of us understand the varying business sensitivities each of us have to honor wherever we work these days.

While per-port would be nice I think any stats would be great. One of the problems I've had in the past is that I couldn't point to a graph of APE and say "Look people are exchanging x Gb/s at peak over this, maybe it will be worth us joining".

Personally I always had a sneaking suspicion that Citylink never released graphs because the actual amount of traffic was tiny. Probably not true but how could I tell?

-- Simon Lyall | Very Busy | Web: http://www.simonlyall.com/ "To stay awake all night adds a day to your life" - Stilgar

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Simon Blake

6:52 a.m.

On Wed, Dec 03, 2014 at 12:15:16PM +1300, Simon Lyall said:

...

Personally I always had a sneaking suspicion that Citylink never released graphs because the actual amount of traffic was tiny. Probably not true but how could I tell?

For a long time, particularly on WIX, there was a mechanical problem of defining what an exchange port, and identifying IX traffic. People pushed traffic into a single shared vlan, some was transit, some was peering, some was point to point private stuff. A graph of all the ingress data in that vlan wasn't particularly meaningful as a way of describing the peering activity, since it had (literally) hundreds of ports doing things unrelated to BGP. Once the process of draining the swamp was underway - splitting the single vlan into transit vlans per ISP and private vlans for point to point (so that the IX was all that was left in the original vlan), there was a period (of a couple of years) where an aggregate graph of the original vlan would have suggested the amount of exchange traffic was falling. During that period, there definitely was a lack of enthusiasm for publishing aggregate ingress data, since the graph trend didn't match reality (at least, reality as we assumed it to be - we didn't have much other hard data on IX trends). Cheers Simon

Brian E Carpenter

1 Dec 1 Dec

12:13 a.m.

On 01/12/2014 23:25, jon.brewer wrote:

...

...
On 1/12/2014, at 20:06, Dean Pemberton wrote:

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P

What do you want to measure? Trans-Tasman traffic reduction, response time reduction, what else? If you want before/after comparison, today would be a good day to make the before measurements. I have a personal data point: v6 ping time to "www.ietf.org" today is 36 ms via SNAP, and that is actually the ping time to Cloudflare in Sydney. I'm hoping to see that down significantly when they come up in Auckland. Anybody can measure ping times, but each ISP would have to measure their own traffic. Brian

...

I hear some exchange operators show per-port participant stats. Was always too "commercially sensitive" for WIX/APE.

...
...
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 6:06 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote: This should provide huge benefit to NZ as we see more content localized.

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog .

Tim Hoffman

12:20 a.m.

Brian,

...

On Dec 1, 2014, at 11:13 AM, Brian E Carpenter wrote:

On 01/12/2014 23:25, jon.brewer wrote:

...
...
On 1/12/2014, at 20:06, Dean Pemberton wrote:

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P

What do you want to measure? Trans-Tasman traffic reduction, response time reduction, what else? If you want before/after comparison, today would be a good day to make the before measurements.

I have a personal data point: v6 ping time to "www.ietf.org" today is 36 ms via SNAP, and that is actually the ping time to Cloudflare in Sydney. I'm hoping to see that down significantly when they come up in Auckland. Anybody can measure ping times, but each ISP would have to measure their own traffic. Where in Snap are you testing from? 36ms is further than I would expect if you are testing from Auckland… but if you are in say… Christchurch.. it would make sense!

Given that we are doing a full deployment in Auckland (servers, everything), I would expect your RTT to basically reflect your distance from Auckland. Cheers, Hoff

...

Brian

...
I hear some exchange operators show per-port participant stats. Was always too "commercially sensitive" for WIX/APE.

...
...
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 6:06 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote: This should provide huge benefit to NZ as we see more content localized.

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog .

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

Brian E Carpenter

12:38 a.m.

On 02/12/2014 08:20, Tim Hoffman wrote:

...

Brian,

...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 11:13 AM, Brian E Carpenter wrote:

On 01/12/2014 23:25, jon.brewer wrote:

...
...
On 1/12/2014, at 20:06, Dean Pemberton wrote:

Now - if only it were possible to tell how much =P What do you want to measure? Trans-Tasman traffic reduction, response time reduction, what else? If you want before/after comparison, today would be a good day to make the before measurements.

I have a personal data point: v6 ping time to "www.ietf.org" today is 36 ms via SNAP, and that is actually the ping time to Cloudflare in Sydney. I'm hoping to see that down significantly when they come up in Auckland. Anybody can measure ping times, but each ISP would have to measure their own traffic. Where in Snap are you testing from? 36ms is further than I would expect if you are testing from Auckland… but if you are in say… Christchurch.. it would make sense!

Auckland. I'll send you a traceroute off list. Brian

...

Given that we are doing a full deployment in Auckland (servers, everything), I would expect your RTT to basically reflect your distance from Auckland.

Cheers, Hoff

...
Brian

...
I hear some exchange operators show per-port participant stats. Was always too "commercially sensitive" for WIX/APE.

...
...
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 6:06 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote: This should provide huge benefit to NZ as we see more content localized.

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog .

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Dean Pemberton

12:34 a.m.

On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 8:13 AM, Brian E Carpenter wrote:

...

What do you want to measure? Trans-Tasman traffic reduction, response time reduction, what else?

Yes to all of that. But how about we start with aggregate data crossing the exchanges? Like these graphs for overseas exchanges. If they can do it then there are obviously no arguments around commercial sensitivities. https://www.de-cix.net/about/statistics/ https://ams-ix.net/technical/statistics https://www.linx.net/pubtools/trafficstats.html http://www.msk-ix.ru/eng/traffic.html http://www.netnod.se/ix-stats/sums/All.html http://www.hkix.net/hkix/stat/aggt/hkix-aggregate.html http://www.jpix.ad.jp/en/technical/traffic.html Longer list here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Internet_exchange_points_by_size

Michael Fincham

4:13 a.m.

On Tue, 2 Dec 2014 08:34:52 +1300 Dean Pemberton wrote:

...

But how about we start with aggregate data crossing the exchanges?

+1, it would be great to have this info available. I assume the new folks coming to Auckland will be doing this and it will be interesting to make comparisons. -- Michael

Tim Hoffman

7 Dec 7 Dec

5:28 a.m.

All, We’re now live on APE and AKL-IX, and Megaport tell me they’ll have our end patched this afternoon. If you’re on the IX and haven’t reached out to us already, email peering(a)cloudflare.com mailto:peering(a)cloudflare.com for a bi-lat. If you’ve already reached out, Marty and Luke will be in touch over the next couple of days. Cheers, Hoff

...

On Dec 1, 2014, at 4:04 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

Thanks Jamie,

CloudFlare are imminently deploying a node in New Zealand, bringing a large amount of content closer to y’all!

We’ll be at all 3 IXs in Auckland, plus will be accepting 1Gbit and 10Gbit single mode fibre PNIs (where traffic levels make a PNI seem sensible) at “The Datacenter” (220 Queen Street, Auckland).

We do provide IPv4 & IPv6 routes to the route-servers at most IXs; however, we only provide a subset of our routes via this mechanism (the non-anycast ones - i.e. not the ones with the content on them!)). A direct peering session between our ASNs will provide all our routes (including the anycast routes) and hence ensure that you are not going offshore to get at our content.

We do not require BGP MD5 passwords (however we will accept your MD5 password, if you use one). We request max-prefix sizes of 500 for IPv4 and 100 for IPv6. Our full peering information can be found in PeeringDB at http://as13335.peeringdb.com/ http://as13335.peeringdb.com/ and is up to date. Our NOC contact info is as follows:

CloudFlare NOC contact: noc(a)cloudflare.com mailto:noc(a)cloudflare.com CloudFlare NOC phone: +1 650 319 8930 CloudFlare Peering contact: peering(a)cloudflare.com mailto:peering(a)cloudflare.com

I’m expecting us to be going live in the next couple of weeks - but for now feel free to email us at the peering address above and Marty and Luke will get back to you as soon as we’re ready to go live.

Thanks in advance for peering!

Cheers, Hoff

...
On Nov 30, 2014, at 5:45 PM, Jamie Baddeley mailto:jamie.baddeley(a)vpc.co.nz> wrote:

With N4L joining the APE the fun keeps coming..

New CDN in town and it's a win for NZ.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-... http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-...

At an operational level I'm sure the CloudFlare guys will provide an update soon.

regards

jamie _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz mailto:NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

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Alexander Neilson

5:31 a.m.

Thanks for the update. Looking forward to seeing the bi-lat up and running. Regards Alexander Alexander Neilson Neilson Productions Limited alexander(a)neilson.net.nz 021 329 681 022 456 2326

...

On 8/12/2014, at 1:28 pm, Tim Hoffman wrote:

All,

We’re now live on APE and AKL-IX, and Megaport tell me they’ll have our end patched this afternoon.

If you’re on the IX and haven’t reached out to us already, email peering(a)cloudflare.com for a bi-lat. If you’ve already reached out, Marty and Luke will be in touch over the next couple of days.

Cheers, Hoff

...
On Dec 1, 2014, at 4:04 PM, Tim Hoffman wrote:

Thanks Jamie,

CloudFlare are imminently deploying a node in New Zealand, bringing a large amount of content closer to y’all!

We’ll be at all 3 IXs in Auckland, plus will be accepting 1Gbit and 10Gbit single mode fibre PNIs (where traffic levels make a PNI seem sensible) at “The Datacenter” (220 Queen Street, Auckland).

We do provide IPv4 & IPv6 routes to the route-servers at most IXs; however, we only provide a subset of our routes via this mechanism (the non-anycast ones - i.e. not the ones with the content on them!)). A direct peering session between our ASNs will provide all our routes (including the anycast routes) and hence ensure that you are not going offshore to get at our content.

We do not require BGP MD5 passwords (however we will accept your MD5 password, if you use one). We request max-prefix sizes of 500 for IPv4 and 100 for IPv6. Our full peering information can be found in PeeringDB at http://as13335.peeringdb.com/ and is up to date. Our NOC contact info is as follows:

CloudFlare NOC contact: noc(a)cloudflare.com CloudFlare NOC phone: +1 650 319 8930 CloudFlare Peering contact: peering(a)cloudflare.com

I’m expecting us to be going live in the next couple of weeks - but for now feel free to email us at the peering address above and Marty and Luke will get back to you as soon as we’re ready to go live.

Thanks in advance for peering!

Cheers, Hoff

...
On Nov 30, 2014, at 5:45 PM, Jamie Baddeley wrote:

With N4L joining the APE the fun keeps coming..

New CDN in town and it's a win for NZ.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1412/S00034/ape-brings-the-world-closer-to-...

At an operational level I'm sure the CloudFlare guys will provide an update soon.

regards

jamie _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

_______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog

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31 comments

19 participants

participants (19)

Alexander Neilson
Brian E Carpenter
Cameron Daniel
Dean Pemberton
Denver Maddux
Jamie Baddeley
Jamie Curtis
Joe Wooller
jon.brewer
Jonathan Brewer
mcfbbqroast .
Michael Fincham
Michael Smith
paul tinson
Simon Blake
Simon Lyall
Tim Hoffman
Tim Hoffman
Tim Warnock