- NZNOG - lists.nznog.org

Re: [nznog] ADSL Rate Limiting on the line.
by neil gardner 23 Oct '04

23 Oct '04

Well, I've never met Bruce, and I do read Aardvark most days, but I think it would be good to get someone that really _knows_ what the impact of reducing the line speed on latency will be. We have a few dslams here for testing but they're been used for real work right now. Anyone _know_ what the effect will be? Cheers - Neil G >>> Richard Nelson <richardn(a)cs.waikato.ac.nz> 22/10/2004 12:44:56 p.m. >>> Maybe you misread it, there is a 'but' in the sentance: "This will likely increase latency for all but those on the full-speed JetStream plans ..." Richard. Craig Spiers wrote: > Hi guys, > > > > Reading todays article on http://www.aardvark.co.nz/ he raves on about > 'increased latency' > > > > Would I be right in saying the latency would only increase on lower speed > jetstream plans - as it takes longer for the packets to pass over a smaller > pipe. > > > > Why is he talking about it increasing latency on full rate jetstream plans? > > > > Cheers > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > NZNOG mailing list > NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz > http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog NOTICE: This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error please notify Allied Telesyn Research Ltd immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender has the authority to issue and specifically states them to be the views of Allied Telesyn Research.

4 4

Weekend reading on Exchanges
by Andy Linton 21 Oct '04

21 Oct '04

Here's a paper on IXes you might like to read: Prescriptive Policy Guide for Developing Nations Wishing to Encourage the Formation of a Domestic Internet Industry http://www.pch.net/resources/papers/policy-guide/policy-guide.html

1 0

FW: Westpac: SERVICE MESSAGE
by Barry Murphy 21 Oct '04

21 Oct '04

Just received: Return-Path: <www(a)forcartex.com.tw> Delivered-To: unix.co.nz-barry(a)unix.co.nz Received: (qmail 57023 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2004 00:25:24 -0000 Received: from www(a)forcartex.com.tw by firewall.unix.co.nz by uid 82 with qmail-scanner-1.22 (uvscan: v4.3.20/v4396. Clear:RC:0(219.88.242.3):. Processed in 0.334605 secs); 22 Oct 2004 00:25:24 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: www(a)forcartex.com.tw via firewall.unix.co.nz X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.22 (Clear:RC:0(219.88.242.3):. Processed in 0.334605 secs) Received: from unknown (HELO dbmail-mx3.orcon.net.nz) (219.88.242.3) by smtp.unix.co.nz with SMTP; 22 Oct 2004 00:25:24 -0000 Received: from mail.unix.co.nz (firewall.unix.co.nz [219.88.241.242]) by dbmail-mx3.orcon.net.nz (8.13.1/8.13.1/Debian-14) with SMTP id i9M0PONQ030574 for <blacklabel(a)orcon.net.nz>; Fri, 22 Oct 2004 13:25:25 +1300 Received: (qmail 57013 invoked by uid 89); 22 Oct 2004 00:25:23 -0000 Delivered-To: barry(a)southafrica.co.nz Received: (qmail 57007 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2004 00:25:22 -0000 Received: from www(a)forcartex.com.tw by firewall.unix.co.nz by uid 82 with qmail-scanner-1.22 (uvscan: v4.3.20/v4396. Clear:RC:0(211.22.18.59):. Processed in 0.985909 secs); 22 Oct 2004 00:25:22 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: www(a)forcartex.com.tw via firewall.unix.co.nz X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.22 (Clear:RC:0(211.22.18.59):. Processed in 0.985909 secs) Received: from unknown (HELO mail.forcartex.com.tw) (211.22.18.59) by smtp.unix.co.nz with SMTP; 22 Oct 2004 00:25:21 -0000 Received: from localhost (localhost.forcartex.com.tw [127.0.0.1]) by mail.forcartex.com.tw (Postfix) with ESMTP id B207F12BC24 for <barry(a)southafrica.co.nz>; Fri, 22 Oct 2004 08:25:18 +0800 (CST) Received: from mail.forcartex.com.tw ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (www.forcartex.com.tw [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10715-03 for <barry(a)southafrica.co.nz>; Fri, 22 Oct 2004 08:25:18 +0800 (CST) Received: by mail.forcartex.com.tw (Postfix, from userid 80) id 4D67012BCA8; Fri, 22 Oct 2004 08:24:21 +0800 (CST) To: barry(a)southafrica.co.nz Subject: Westpac: SERVICE MESSAGE MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 From: Westpac New Zealand <service(a)westpac.co.nz> Reply-To: service(a)westpac.co.nz X-Mailer: PHP/4.3.8 Message-Id: <20041022002421.4D67012BCA8(a)mail.forcartex.com.tw> Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2004 08:24:21 +0800 (CST) X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.75-1, clamav-milter version 0.75c on dbmail-mx3 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at forcartex.com.tw X-Amavis-Alert: BAD HEADER Improper use of control character (char 0D hex) in message header 'MIME-Version': MIME-Version: 1.0\r\n Received-SPF: none (dbmail-mx3.orcon.net.nz: 219.88.241.242 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of forcartex.com.tw) receiver=dbmail-mx3.orcon.net.nz; client-ip=219.88.241.242; helo=mail.unix.co.nz; envelope-from=www(a)forcartex.com.tw; x-software=spfmilter 0.93 http://www.acme.com/software/spfmilter/; X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-DCC: : X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.64 (2004-01-11) on firewall.unix.co.nz X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,HTML_MESSAGE, HTML_TITLE_UNTITLED,MIME_HTML_ONLY autolearn=no version=2.64 _____ From: Westpac New Zealand [mailto:service(a)westpac.co.nz] Sent: Friday, 22 October 2004 1:24 p.m. To: barry(a)southafrica.co.nz Subject: Westpac: SERVICE MESSAGE <http://www.westpac.co.nz/w_nz.gif> Dear Westpac customer, Recently there has been a large number of identity theft attempts targeting Westpac customers. In order to safeguard your account, we require that you confirm your banking details. This process is mandatory, and if not completed within the nearest time your account may be subject to temporary suspension. To securely confirm your Westpac account details, please fill in the form that will follow after signing in at: http://www.westpac.co.nz/personal/Checking/OnlineBanking/Internet_Banking/in dex.cfm <http://www.saracie.org/secure/online/adtrack/IOLB/newSession/nz.htm> Thank you for your prompt attention to this matter and for using Westpac! Westpac Banking Corporation ABN 33 007 457 141, incorporated in Australia (New Zealand division). CopyrightC1999-2004 Westpac Banking Corporation

3 2

ADSL Rate Limiting on the line.
by Craig Spiers 21 Oct '04

21 Oct '04

Hi guys, Reading todays article on http://www.aardvark.co.nz/ he raves on about 'increased latency' Would I be right in saying the latency would only increase on lower speed jetstream plans - as it takes longer for the packets to pass over a smaller pipe. Why is he talking about it increasing latency on full rate jetstream plans? Cheers

2 2

Unsubscription from NZNOG
by Donald Neal 21 Oct '04

21 Oct '04

After repeatedly making postings to this list which were not compatible with the list's acseptable use policy, Michael Hallager has been unsubscribed from the NZNOG list. I have received a number of complaints about his behaviour. My thanks to those subscribers for not sending their complaints to the list. - Donald Neal NZNOG Mailing List Administrator Donald Neal |Presbyopia - inability to see what Technical Specialist | bishops are for. Operations Engineering | Integration & Services Division +----------------------------------- Alcatel NZ Ltd - Telecom's network operations manager ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "This communication, including any attachments, is confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not read it - please contact me immediately, destroy it, and do not copy or use any part of this communication or disclose anything about it. Thank you. Please note that this communication does not designate an information system for the purposes of the Electronic Transactions Act 2002." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 0

Re: [nznog] FYI: Telecom changes the ADSL playing field again...
by neil gardner 20 Oct '04

20 Oct '04

>>> Stephen Ridley <stephen.ridley(a)k.co.nz> 21/10/2004 11:00:01 a.m. >>> >And the latency is somewhat better than what we used to get from the jetstream >link: >traceroute to xtra.co.nz (202.27.184.102), 30 hops max, 38 byte packets > 1 a.a.a.a (a.a.a.a) 0.926 ms 0.864 ms 0.922 ms > 2 b.b.b.b (b.b.b.b) 8.465 ms 8.123 ms 12.425 ms > 3 cs2-e4-7-acld.auckland.clix.net.nz (203.97.9.98) 8.771 ms 9.305 ms 9.286 ms > 4 g1-0-927.u11.tspn.telstraclear.net (218.101.61.6) 11.422 ms 10.660 ms 10.282 ms > 5 xtra.ape.net.nz (192.203.154.60) 14.338 ms 10.610 ms 10.278 ms > 6 v512.XTRAK2-B1.xtra.co.nz (202.27.176.226) 11.048 ms 10.160 ms 10.023 ms We don't need no Interleaving We don't need no surf control No dark deals screwing VOIP Telcos, leave them bits alone Hey, Telcos! Leave them bits alone! All in all it's just another service to fall All in all, you're just a consumer that's going to get screwed by corporate greed and can't do a damn thing about it at all! (Apologies to Pink Floyd and for the number of syllables in the last line :-) N. NOTICE: This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error please notify Allied Telesyn Research Ltd immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender has the authority to issue and specifically states them to be the views of Allied Telesyn Research.

5 4

RE: [nznog] FYI: Telecom changes the ADSL playing field again...
by Steve Schmidt 20 Oct '04

20 Oct '04

The question will be "Free" for how much longer? I have heard rumors that Citylink may have some new tricks up their sleeve (free to comment, open for blasting) to try and maintain free peering exchanges but it will ultimately come down to all the "other" isp's ensuring that they continue to peer at the exchanges. (note: MCI/Voyager just completing their own peering hub and peering arrangements are now being "reviewed") TCNZ are reviewing. TCL have already made their intentions clear. (pardon the pun :-) -----Original Message----- From: Richard Patterson [mailto:richard(a)helix.net.nz] Sent: Thursday, 21 October 2004 10:28 a.m. To: nznog(a)list.waikato.ac.nz Subject: Re: [nznog] FYI: Telecom changes the ADSL playing field again... J S Russell wrote: > >Doesn't this kinda defeat the whole point of having a seperate realm for >JSG, then? That full-speed business was the only thing that made it >interesting. If your connectivity to it is the same as your connectivity >to any other normally-peered (Hi TelstraClear!) New Zealand game server, >why bother maintaining it as a seperate realm you need to re-login to >access? It was worth the bother to re-login when it got you decent speeds, >but without them it's just a pain in the ass. You may as well just lift >the access lists and put allow access to these machines from the general >internet. Or is that what's happening anyway? I remember hearing something >recently about JSG going away. > > > > > Well it won't count to your usage cap. Your 10Gb Usage cap. Including NATIONAL Traffic National traffic thats delivered over the public peering exchanges. Thats ~free anyway. </rant> _______________________________________________ NZNOG mailing list NZNOG(a)list.waikato.ac.nz http://list.waikato.ac.nz/mailman/listinfo/nznog -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. CAUTION: This e-mail and any attachment(s) contains information that is intended to be read only by the named recipient(s). It may contain information that is confidential, proprietary or the subject of legal privilege. This information is not to be used by any other person and/or organisation. If you are not the intended recipient, please advise us immediately and delete this e-mail from your system. Do not use any information contained in it.

9 19

RE: [nznog] FYI: Telecom changes the ADSL playing field again...
by Donald Neal 20 Oct '04

20 Oct '04

Subscribers to this list should by now be well aware that the Acceptable Use Policy begins "The NZNOG mailing list exists to provide a forum for the exchange of technical information and the discussion of implementation issues that require cooperation among New Zealand network service providers. In order to continue to provide a useful forum for discussion of relevant technical issues, users of the list are asked to respect the following guidelines. 1. Discussion will focus on Internet operational and technical issues. 2. Discussion related to meetings of network service providers is appropriate. 3. Discussion unrelated to these topics is not appropriate." This does include, for example, discussion of the way QoS features are used in carrier-class networks. But ADSL-related threads on this list have a record of quickly becoming irrelevant to the list's purpose. Let's try and keep this on topic, please. - Donald Neal NZNOG list administrator Donald Neal |Presbyopia - inability to see what Technical Specialist | bishops are for. Operations Engineering | Integration & Services Division +----------------------------------- Alcatel NZ Ltd - Telecom's network operations manager ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "This communication, including any attachments, is confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not read it - please contact me immediately, destroy it, and do not copy or use any part of this communication or disclose anything about it. Thank you. Please note that this communication does not designate an information system for the purposes of the Electronic Transactions Act 2002." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 0

FYI: Telecom changes the ADSL playing field again...
by Craig Humphrey 20 Oct '04

20 Oct '04

This just came up in the NZ ADSL list: http://www.telecom.co.nz/content/0,3900,204368-201502,00.html Many of you (who work for ISPs) are probably already aware of this, but here's a quick summary: 1. Telecom moving the rate-limiting to the DSLAM and implementing new backend QoS. 2. Telecom apparently (pointed out by an NZ ADSL user) introducing a further 30ms of latency to ADSL connections (presumably due to new QoS). 3. JetStream Games realm and Remote.Office connections will now be limited to connection plan speed (due to the limiting being done at the DSLAM). Yes, this will impact the usage of the jetstreamgames.co.nz and ftp.paradise.net.nz(?) game/linux/bsd mirrors. Note: this is just a mixture of my interpretation and info garnered from NZ ADSL. I/we could be completely wrong :) Later'ish Craig

9 8

Re: [nznog] FYI: Telecom changes the ADSL playing field again...
by neil gardner 20 Oct '04

20 Oct '04

>>> Barry Murphy <barry(a)unix.co.nz> 21/10/2004 10:23:04 a.m. >>> >Telstra Clear already do this with their tempest service, if you purchase a >256k connection, check your router status and you'll see you are connected at >288k. They at least give 32k leaway. Not really - that 288k is 288k of ATM bandwidth... It translates (as best I can figure) to 31.32Kb/sec or 250.56kbits of real world transfer... So you're actually getting more than 256kbits of raw traffic, it's the TCP overheads that bring the number below 256. Cheers - Neil G (Reference : http://www.broadbandreports.com/information/kb/maximum+DSL+speeds/ATM) quoted below maximum DSL speeds Maximum DSL speed is a function of distance, the gauge (thinness) of the phone wire used in your locale, and the DSL technology employed. The fastest DSL now commonly available is ADSL, and it offers maximum download speeds of up to 7.1mbps and around 1.1m upload. Most residential ADSL is limited to 90-680k for download, depending on the Telco. SDSL currently has a max of 1.5mbps, but that is both up and down (symmetric). Other common rates are (in k bits per second) 640k/90k, 1600k/90k, 680k/680k for ADSL. Rule of thumb for converting speeds to something easier to understand: take the k bps, and divide by 10. This is the maximum transfer K per second you are ever likely to see in a browser download window. More accurately, divide by 8 and take off 13%, which is overhead from tcp/ip and, more importantly, ATM overhead. (DSL lines use ATM as an underlying data-transport protocol). Modems range from 2-5k a second, DSL lines from 10-500k a second, office computer interconnections are usually either (best case) 800k a second (10mbit) or 8000k a second (100mbit switched). NOTICE: This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error please notify Allied Telesyn Research Ltd immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender has the authority to issue and specifically states them to be the views of Allied Telesyn Research.

1 0